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Thanks for another nice lecture

Iron

Thank you for keeping this lecture series available for archive viewing. I found it quite informative. Mr. Labrosse is an excellent teacher.

Iron

Great review of RTOS. Thanks!

Iron

Thank you Jean. The week was interesting and I have a better understanding of real time kernel operation and pitfalls.

Iron

hello all from Edmonton, Alberta.

Iron

RTOS details / debug tricks

Never heard about books

debugger / break points

Very good series. Thank you.

Great series.

Thank you J & J.

Iron

No more questions.  Thank you all for listening and chatting.

Hope you enjoyed this series.

Kindest regards,

Jean

Blogger

CurtG:

Jean, a compiler could only estimate a task's stack size after it profiled the code, idealy during run time. Do you see any other way a compiler could do this?

 

The IAR compiler can give you an estimate at link time.  Each function has a stack usage displayed next to it.  There are some limitation when it comes to function tables but it's still better than nothing.

Blogger

Jean, a compiler could only estimate a task's stack size after it profiled the code, idealy during run time. Do you see any other way a compiler could do this?

Iron

CurtG:
Jean, how do you determine the optimal stack size for a task while still achieving memory efficiency?

I know IAR came out with a version of their compiler (V6.5 I think) that actually shows estimated stack use on a per-function basis.  This is in the link-map.  VERY useful.

 

Blogger

CurtG:
Jean, how do you determine the optimal stack size for a task while still achieving memory efficiency?

The other thing is that you can, roughly estimate the stack usage of some tasks if you know who calls what, how many arguments are pushed, how many bytes of local storage, etc.  A painful way to determine stack requirements and, difficult to be sure, especially if you use library functions.

Blogger

CurtG:
Jean, how do you determine the optimal stack size for a task while still achieving memory efficiency?

Also, interesting you mention that because, one of my Engineers is hitting a wall with doing an application and has that same issue.  Unfortunately, the tools he has to use doesn't provide any form of 'Kernel Awareness' and, he doesn't have enough RAM left to use the RS-232C version of uC/Probe to tell him.  I'm sure he over allocated some stacks and I recommended that he looked at the TCB where the actual stack us is recorded.

Blogger

CurtG:
Jean, how do you determine the optimal stack size for a task while still achieving memory efficiency?

That's a very good question and in many cases, you have to estimate it (or over-estimate it) and, see stack usage after running your code for a long time.  From that, you can scale the size back.

Blogger

cghaba:

Do you know where can be find an exhaustive list of RT kernel objects and services?

 

Not sure what you mean by the question.  If you mean what are all the types of objects that have ever been created for kernels?  If so, not that many.

Semaphores, Mutexes, Queues, Mailboxes, Pipes, Event Flags, Soft-Timers, Memory partitions and that's about it.

Blogger

Do you know where can be find an exhaustive list of RT kernel objects and services?

Iron

I'm trying to post my answer to CurtG ... long answer.  I posted it twice.  Will try again.

Blogger

Very informative class, Jean, thank you.

In other news, although my browser 'Find' says my question did go through, here it is again:
What do you see as the future of RTOS/RTKs in regard to parallel processing?

Iron

TI website just list new Tiva cortex-m4 line now. Anyway learning uC/oOSIII with TI Stalleris robot gave me more fun. Thanks Jean. hopfully you have another detail lecture on Digikey.

Iron

Slide 10, D/A conversion out aprox. equals analog out

Iron

Stellaris was awesome line - Ethernet MAC & PHYS in one package, unique thing.

Iron

aranjbar:

On Slide 10, what the voltage level (off oscillescope) represent?

 

The voltage on the scope trace would tell you which task is currently running.  For that, you'd need to 'know' what voltage corresponds to what task.  Here I assume that 'you' would be the one that would instrument your code to do that.

 

Like I said, most kernels provide 'hook functions' or 'callbask' when the kernel performs a context switch.  You would simply write that callback function to output the value of the current task (or ISR) to the DAC.

 

Blogger

Thanks Jean and oompany.

 

Jean, how do you determine the optimal stack size for a task while still achieving memory efficiency?

Iron

sherlock:

Hi Jean,

You know my book and evaluation is base on TI stalleras robot. But TI seemsliy gave up Stalleris. Do you think i need change to other Cortex-M of other company?

 

Well, it's difficult for me to advise you to pick one of the many Cortex-M chip suppliers.  We support them all.  The TI EVALBOT was great and a fun kit to put together.

 

I'm quite surprised that TI would drop the Stellaris line.

Blogger

On Slide 10, what the voltage level (off oscillescope) represent?

Iron
Thanks, good lectures.
Iron

Posts aren't always going through - Hadn't heard of uC/OS before this class ... I am new to RTKs though.

Iron

EdB_Vt:
I know about the books, would like to understand implementing Ethernet.

I highly recommend the uC/TCP-IP books.  There is one for the Renesas RX62N, Renesas SH7216, ST STM32, Freescale Kinetis and TI LM3S9B92.

 

Again, you can download for FREE from our website ... PDF format.

Blogger

rrsqd: SPI is very simple protocol, probably you need logical analyzer or like it - LEDs for example and low frequency tacting for see what happened in circuit

Iron

Good lecture &

good day.

Iron

garysxt:

Yes, I have the uc/OS II book. Wasn't uc/OS first described in a series of RTOS articles in Embedded Systems Design many years ago?

 

Yes, May, June, Sept, Oct. 1992.

Then I published the uC/OS book towards the end of 1992.  260 pages.

In 1998, I published uC/OS-II, 600 or so pages.

In 2009, I created MicriumPress and published uC/OS-III, about 900 pages.

 

Blogger

I appreicate having access to your books in PDF. I have your book on uC/OSII, but its a bear to lug around...

Iron

cghaba:
Are uC-Probe and uC-Trace free available for educational purposes?

 

1) There is a FREE evaluation version of uC/Probe on our website.  It provides the full functionality of uC/Probe except that it nags you to purchase the full version.  The licensed version is only $200.

 

2) uC/Trace is not available yet (slide #12) but we are in the process of preparing for an August release.  Again there will be a free evaluation version and a licensed version.

Blogger

What do you see as the future of RTOS/RTKs in regard to parallel processing?

Iron
Anyone Have any suggestions on learning SPI protocol? Details
Iron

Thank you Jean and Jennifer for the very useful course!

I class on porting uC-OSIII to a new processor or things to watch out for when vendors come out with new parts would be interesting

I have heard of Micrium before and used TI's Stellaris EvalBot

Thank you Jean and Jennifer

Iron

Hi Jean,

You know my book and evaluation is base on TI stalleras robot. But TI seemsliy gave up Stalleris. Do you think i need change to other Cortex-M of other company?

Iron

Yes, I have a copy of uC/OS II

Iron

Yes I have uC/OS-II just in front me

Iron

Jennifer, Jean,

Thank you for this week a great period of the instruction.

I see you next time.

Iron

Yes, have heard of uC/OS.

Would like to see more RTOS details specific to the ARM Cortex with examples to compare systems without one.

Iron

@Jennifer could yo put thet link for LinkedIn Group?

 

Iron

aranjbar:

Jean, should the value of a semaphore get set to the number of resources that it protect. For example, if there are 16 buffers that the sempahore protects, the initial value of the semaphore be 16 not zero right?

 

Correct.

Blogger

I have a copy of uC/OS II.

Thanks Jean and Jennifer and Digi-Key.

Iron

I know about the books, would like to understand implementing Ethernet.

Thanks Jean, Jennifer, & Digi-Key

Iron

I have theuC/OS-III  book and the ARM Cortex SOC to go with it

I would like to a see continuation of this session going more-indepth on a specific target - e.g. Cortex-M3

Iron

Terrific class. Thanks Jean. And Thanks Jennifer and Digi-Key

Iron

Jack Gannssle has done reviews of many of these books and included them as references in his own books and classes ... (Jack is /was another fine DigiKey CEC instructor and industry guru).  A fine capstone to emdedded design -- nice intro course!

Thanks Jean and Jennifer for the classes this week! 

Iron

Jean thank you for the lectures, all of them very informative

Jennifer thank you

Thank you Design news and Digi-key

Iron

Have heard of uC-OS-II, uC-OS-III, not the books

Iron

Yes, I have the uc/OS II book. Wasn't uc/OS first described in a series of RTOS articles in Embedded Systems Design many years ago?

Iron

I think I've heard of uc/OS-III before, but I have not seen/heard of the resources themselves before

 

possible next topic: a walk-through of some practical source-code examples of drivers which use the techniques discussed in this lecture series (maybe even out of the uC/OS source!)

 

thanks for the great series this week!

Iron

Read about uC/OS-II and III when doing an RTOS survey for RA.

Are uC-Probe and uC-Trace free available for educational purposes?

Iron

Topics - performance testing

Thanks Jean and Jennifer. I already bought your book and evaluation board.

Iron

I've heard of uC/OSII...  not used it since most of my targets have been VxWorks or Linux...

Iron

Thank you, Jean! nice course. And thank to Digi-Key!

Iron

Heard of your boks and micrium's RTOSes

Iron

Thank you Jean and Jennifer.

Iron

Have your book on uC/OSII.

Additional topics: Advanced RTOS concepts. Actual examples and case studies.

Iron

Heard about uC/OS-II and uC/OS-III but not the books before today.

 

Yes, I have heard about micrium kernels but I have not used them.

Iron

This pesentation is the first time I heard of any of these products

Iron

1. Yes

2. Advanced RTOS or real time kernel 

Iron

Thank you Jean!

Thank Jennifer!

Iron

Have not heard prior to this, but very interesting and thank you for the lecture

Iron

Thank you Jean for a great series.

Iron

Used uCII in the past.

Thank you for the class, Jean, Jennifer, and Digi-Key

had not heard of the books before. Thanks for references to resources.

Gold

I heard and used uCOS-II for educational purposes.

Iron

Never heard of uC/OS or the books.

Iron

Yes. I've heard of uC/OSII and uC/OSIII.

Iron

No, never herad about these books

Iron

I have not, but am new to RTOS's and Kernels

 

Iron

Yes, I have heard but not registered for download

Iron

I have the uc/os II book.

Iron

Yes have heard of uC/OS.

Iron

  Jean's questions were:

Have you heard about uC/OS-II and/or uC/OS-III and my books?

 

What subjects would you like to see covered as a lecture series?

debugger and serial port for logging

Iron

serial port always busy in mine devices, so not too easy to use it for debug purposes

Iron

Jean, should the value of a semaphore get set to the number of resources that it protect. For example, if there are 16 buffers that the sempahore protects, the initial value of the semaphore be 16 not zero right?

Iron

Mostly debugger with breakpoints.  I/O pin output to scope when checking individual tasks.

Iron

break points and gpios

Iron

mixed-signal scope, one pin per task (when possible)

Iron

'Watch' window is my favorite

breakpoints, debugger, analyzer, using spare GPIO at debugging. Depends from task

Iron

stream using CANalyzer, trace info, breakpoints, scope and logic analyzer

 

 

Iron

Breakpoints, gpios and serial output

Mostly use debugger and Break point.

Iron

Never use print statements on debugging.

Iron

Pic debugger/breakpoints with scope and digital output for timing

Iron

I use debugging tools with break points and printfs.  Scopes and logic analyzer if absolutely necessary.

Iron

I do use breakpoint and I use IO Port debugging.

Iron

Debugger and breakpoints

Iron

Breakpoints.  Output Bits. serial stream.

Iron

Mainly debugger and breakpoints.

Iron

Multiple contexts depending upon hardware

 

Iron

all of the choices depending on the environment, application, etc

Iron

printf()'s primarily

Debugger and breakpoints, captured traces, using Lauterbach and GDB, also have developed some custom tools to view how the OS is behaving.

Iron

MPLAB step and printf. These new ideas will be helpful.

Gold

Yes I use debugger and BP for tracking code.

Iron

print statements

 

Iron

printf() statements only - so far.

Iron

Use break points, printf, and GPIO that output to LEDs or can be seen on a logic analyzer.

Iron

debugger and output bits

Iron

printf, and external logic analyzer.

Iron

printf's work! also, gdb

Iron

All of them depending on the situation.

  Jean's question was:

How do you 'see' what's happening in your embedded system?

   Do you use a debugger and breakpoints?

   Do you use 'printf()' statements?

   Does your debugger allow you to capture trace information?

Gnu/Make for the most part.  Debugging normally via prnt statements since working on a large multithreaded ap

Iron

I currently use IAR and eclipse depending on the chip vendor 

Eclipse editor with chip mfg tools

Iron

2 projects.  1 is using code sourcery (GNU) w/o and os.  The other is using IAR with PowerPac (EmbOS).

Eclipse for code sourcery and the eclipse plug-in for IAR.  I like eclipse better than the IAR workbench but the debugging is better in IAR.

I've used Keil,  manufacrturers, Eclipse, and GNU. 

Iron

Microchip MPLAB, Kiel

Iron

eclipse-based. Prefer IAR though.

 

Iron

Chip manufacturer's tools.

Iron

Chip manufacturer tool

Iron

Not using a kernel, but using GNU GCC, GDB with an BDI3000 JTAG debugger.

 

Iron

GNU, it is ok.  I like the Eclipse IDE better than IAR or Keil though compiler configuration can be a pain some times.

Iron

Yes I like Keil and IAR.

Iron

prefer gnu in general

Iron

Keil, Eclipse 

 

Iron

Use Chip Manuf. tools. Don't have anything else to compare.

Iron

Keil and Eclipse,  There are issues with both.

Iron

pickit - adequate as the kernel is inhouse.

Iron

No tool chain - early days.

Iron

heard of keil/iar, but no chance yet to try them out

Iron

Rowley Crossworks for ARM.

Chip manufacturer's tools

Iron

Jean's question was:

 What toolchain do you use?

   IAR?  Keil?  GNU?  Eclipse-based?

   The chip manufacturer's tools?

   Do you like it?

Stream started for me now. After 12 minutes!!!!! strange.

Iron

Hello from Hot Toronto!

Iron

Mr. Labrosse,

 

I'm catching up on Day4 right now, and am almost done so should join in on day5 soon. I have one suggestion for your slide#13 on semaphores&priority inversions: on the task C #7 segment, show that the semaphore is released prior to the end of the #7 segment, so that it is clear that it is available prior to the #8 segment (hence available for task A to take it). Just a thought. I think the diagram is a very good one overall. I have really enjoyed this series and hope you can do another (perhaps more advanced one?) in the future!

 

Thanks!

Iron

Audio is horribly dropout-prone today.

Iron

Audio keeps cutting out making it impossible to follow the presentation.  I hope the audio will be available for download later, because I'm going to cut out now too.  Goodbye.

Iron

Is it my luck? I can never listen to the live stream. It seems there is a huge lag.

 

 

Iron

It is blistering here in NJ, and very high Humidity

Iron

Good afternoon, everyone

Iron
Or save it for use on your next road trip..
Iron

@bitbanger55 Or give as a gift.

Iron

Hi All, from Steamy Boston, TGIF!

Iron
Hello -from Neptune NJ, USA

bitbanger55: I'd rather one of my buddies like you guys get it.

Gold

78RPM: You can always sell the card at a discount.

Hi all - Audio is live!

I got cashad out early years ago

I'm retired, at the sh!t still flows downhill etc.

Iron

Greetings from Metro Boston, MA. An oppressive 98 degrees F today!!

Iron

Jennifer, don't send me a Starbuck's card. The nearest Starbucks is 80 miles away.

Gold

Almost time!!!! Drum roll please!!!!!

Hello from Timisoara, Romania

Iron

Greetings from Wheaton ,IL

Hello from Michigan

Iron

Good evening from Iasi, Romania

Iron

Hello from Longmont, CO

Iron
rruther2: MOst of us are on a salary and paid every two weeks..rain or shine.

Hello from Greensboro NC

Iron

Hi from Greece

 

Iron

Where's Mishawaka?

Gold

hello from Mishawaka

Iron

Oregon here, in the cool 70's =)

Iron

105º in Boston? Yikes!

Iron

Gee we are only 94 degrees in Phoenix  area (Chndler, AZ) so far!

 

Iron

Florida sleepwalking in ...

Iron

It's 105F in the sun here in Boston!

Hello from Albuquerque again.

Iron

Aloha from Montana. 75 sunny degrees.

Gold

Sunny So Cal here again

Iron

HI everyone, welcome to day 5! Don't forget to download today's slide deck before we begin.

Yo ...@ Rockwell?

... and is pay day on Friday

Iron

Hello from Beaverton, Oregon

Iron

Many have been saying "TGIF" and we at Rockwell think something like that too..we only work 8 hours on Fridays! Woohoo!!!

Hello from sunny Atlanta

Iron

Hello from Johnson City, TN...

Iron

bitbanger: It's humid/vapor wet and about 90 F!

It looks like it might rain here in Colorado.  If so, I'll just put the rainsuit on when I ride the motorcycle home...

Iron

T.G.I.F.

& The Sterbucks prizes!!!

Iron

Hello from hot and humid Binghamton, NY

Iron

@jjrochow@ra.rockwell.com : is that rainy water wet or humid vapor wet?

Greetings from Colorado Springs.

Iron

Hello from Rockwell Automation in warm and wet Cleveland Ohio.

Greetings from Chicago!

Iron

Hello from Scottsdale

Iron

Hello everyone from Vancouver.

Iron

made it on time today

Iron

good morning, everyone

Iron

Hello from Chicago

Iron

Good morning from portland oregon

Iron

Good morning from Argentina

Iron

Good morning from Mobile, AL

I'm beginning to think someone has remapped my keyboard!!!!

Iron

Good lookin' kernel debug vizzes on slides 11 & 12!



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