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ChriSharek
User Rank
Gold
Re: Definitely not good news
ChriSharek   3/29/2013 10:58:10 AM
NO RATINGS
Good points, Charles.  I guess what I'm trying to say is that the battery in the Volt didn't cause the fire - like the Mitzubishi or Boeing.  In those fires, the cause of the fire was the battery.

Regardless, the ignorant media will smear this bad news all over EVs.  Very bad news for the industry.

ChasChas
User Rank
Gold
????
ChasChas   3/29/2013 10:36:02 AM
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"In a lithium-ion battery, you've got electrodes that are tens of microns from one another," (Apparently the biggest problem.)

Charles, any info on why it is so hard to space these eletrodes out a bit?

Charles Murray
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Definitely not good news
Charles Murray   3/29/2013 10:30:09 AM
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You raise a very good point about the Volt fire, ChriSharek. However, I'm going to take a slight issue with what you've said. The truth is that the battery cells had nothing to do with the Volt fire, but the battery pack did. You're correct that the fire occurred after coolant leaked onto a printed circuit board at the top of the battery pack. Let's remember, though, that the coolant is there precisely because this is an energetic chemistry. And when GM fixed the Volt, all of the fixes were done to the battery pack. They beefed up the battery safety cage to resist the kinds of forces seen in the NHTSA tests; they added a sensor to monitor battery coolant levels; they provided a tamper-resistant bracket to prevent overfilling of the battery's coolant reservoir. Perhaps we're both putting too fine a point on it, but all these components are part of the battery, and they wouldn't have been there in the first place if lithium-ion cells didn't have such an edgy chemistry. To say that the fire had "nothing" to do with the lithium-ion battery is incorrect.

Charles Murray
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Air or liquid cooled?
Charles Murray   3/29/2013 10:12:46 AM
NO RATINGS
The Outlander uses air cooling, ChriSharek.

ChriSharek
User Rank
Gold
Re: Definitely not good news
ChriSharek   3/29/2013 9:16:52 AM
Charles, you should know better than to brought the Volt fire up . . . that fire had NOTHING to do with the lithium ion battery.  It was the coolant surrounding the battery that leaked on a circuit board that caused the short circuit.  It was NOT the Li battery. 

Shame on you, Charles . . .

ChriSharek
User Rank
Gold
Air or liquid cooled?
ChriSharek   3/29/2013 9:15:11 AM
NO RATINGS
Was this battery air-cooled like the Nissan Leaf and Boeing, or liquid cooled like the Volt and the new Ford PHEV and EVs? 

a.saji
User Rank
Silver
Re: Next Generation Battery Technologies
a.saji   3/29/2013 12:02:40 AM
NO RATINGS
@Greg: Lithium Batteries always had this issue and it happened to something else sometime back. I simply cannot see why they did not see it coming their way after knowing the impacts

Greg M. Jung
User Rank
Platinum
Next Generation Battery Technologies
Greg M. Jung   3/28/2013 9:38:15 PM
NO RATINGS
It seems the that current lithium-ion technology has to find a safe, reliable way to counteract the energetic and rapid discharge nature of these batteries before wide-spread adoption should truly be deployed.

 

Is there another battery technology appearing on the horizon soon that is safer than lithium-ion?

Charles Murray
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Definitely not good news
Charles Murray   3/28/2013 6:40:07 PM
The Chevy Volt actually had a problem with a lithium-ion fire, too. In Chevy's case, though, the problem occurred after crash-testing, which is different than this. As to how big of a problem it was, I specifically asked Donald Sadoway of MIT, who is one of the world's foremost battery experts and founder of a grid storage battery company called Ambri, whether the media was making a big deal out of a small story. His full response: "The press is right to call attention to the precarious nature of Li-ion technology. It's one thing to have a fire in a plant. It's another to have a fire in a plane at 40,000 feet. Remember, Li-ion technology is 20 years old now. Shouldn't we have worked out the bugs by now?"

Charles Murray
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Definitely not good news
Charles Murray   3/28/2013 6:33:21 PM
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A recall is a possibility, Liz. Mitsubishi has not made an announcement as yet.

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