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akwaman
User Rank
Gold
Re: When the Market should choose
akwaman   1/4/2013 9:58:39 AM
How can you be skeptical of the results? GTOlover:  Toyota has sold millions of hybrids, and their repair records are unbeatable.  Since the ICE engine is the most complicated, expensive and problematic component of a car, the hybrids and electrics have the advantage.  For instance, my Prius only needs an oil change every 10,000 miles, because it is not used nearly as much  or as hard as a conventional ICE.  I am really suprised that the bias caused and created by oil companies toward electrics and hybrids is actually believed.

Bunter
User Rank
Platinum
Re: Promising findings
Bunter   1/4/2013 9:53:23 AM
Yup.  This is what makes any value comparisons, whether vs. Cruze or Prius or whatever, utterly meaningless.  It may be a great car, but it is easier to build a great 30k car if you can spend 60k, 70k or who-knows-what to make it.

When it is affordable and profitable I will be impressed.

Cheerio,

Dennis

akwaman
User Rank
Gold
Not Surprised at all
akwaman   1/4/2013 9:49:31 AM
NO RATINGS
Some people really need to look at the numbers, many people forget to factor in the monthly saving in gasoline.  If your commute is small, hybrids and electrics might not be your thing.  If you drive any kind of appreciable miles, there is a huge difference.

I just drove my Prius 2100 miles, and it didn't skip a beat, tight as a rock.  Hope you got a great warranty... and you are fooling yourself if you think OIL prices are going anywhere but UP.

Hybrids and Electrics have everything to like, and it is obvious that these owners surveyed don't miss their ICE counterparts in the slightest bit.  Do they feel cheated because their car payments are higher? Of course not, because they laugh at all the denyers at the pump putting $60-100 in their tanks.  I put 30 dollars in the tank and it goes 500 miles.  I just took a road trip 2100 miles in total, didn't worry about speed (avg 66mph) and got 47.9mpg avg in my Prius. Here is the damage:

Current trip:

43.84 Gallons used X $3.25 (avg Gas Price) = $142.48 for the entire trip

If I took old car, Toyota Solara: stats from previous trip, current Gas Price, 18.5mpg

113.51 Gallons used X $3.25 (avg Gas Price) = $368.91

That is a difference of $226.44

The savings paid for 2 hotels and food and drink on the trip.

Why the Hell would anyone want to go back to an conventional ICE engine?

GTOlover
User Rank
Platinum
Re: When the Market should choose
GTOlover   1/4/2013 9:49:11 AM
NO RATINGS
I am also skeptical of the results. Low volume sales of a high priced hybrid/electric would tend to go to those most passionate of the technology and climate change fears. Their 'feel good' attitude is biased. What would be more interesting is to watch warranty claims if/when the volume of production goes up. At low volume, it should be easy to make good cars!

warren@fourward.com
User Rank
Platinum
Re: Promising findings
warren@fourward.com   1/4/2013 9:48:54 AM
Sure the owners are happy getting a subsidized $100,000 car for $30,000.

warren@fourward.com
User Rank
Platinum
Re: When the Market should choose
warren@fourward.com   1/4/2013 9:46:20 AM
NO RATINGS
Amen, brother. If it can't stand on its own I don't want it. I will never buy a GM product again because of government abuse of the marketplace.

g-whiz
User Rank
Gold
How many polled were actual Volt owners?
g-whiz   1/4/2013 9:46:16 AM
NO RATINGS
Of the 350,000 polled, how many were actual Volt owners? 100? 200? From what I've read, if you eliminate the Volts sold to the government, sales have been dismal.

VoltDave
User Rank
Iron
Re: Perhaps not significant
VoltDave   1/4/2013 9:39:36 AM
NO RATINGS
I have a Volt.  Like the CR survey responders I am very happy with the car.  A couple of comments.  I don't think you could get a comparable Cruze for half the price.  The Volt comes pretty loaded.  And performance and handling are much better.  My commute is over 37 miles.  37 miles is no limit, however, the advantages do diminish with a longer commute.  I average over 100 miles per gallon of gas even with my longer commute.  As far as being "committed" to charging every night, or thinking it is some kind of hassle.  I would compare it to being "committed" to closing your garage door every night (it's every bit as much a similar habit now), and about as difficult as plugging in a cell phone charger.  I estimate that it takes 30 seconds total to plug in and unplug. I'll take that 30 seconds of hassle every day to cut my number of trips to the gas station to less than one per month.

mikec711
User Rank
Silver
When the Market should choose
mikec711   1/4/2013 9:19:16 AM
My concern is that, as a taxPayer, I funded LOTS of Volt purchases this year. I would love to see technology stand on its own sooner rather than have gov't make market decisions. Maybe the Volt is good stuff, maybe a better technology is out there that the gov't didn't choose to subsidize.  I wish there was a model for introducing technology by which the market and not the politicians (using taxPayer $s) got to decide.

Mydesign
User Rank
Platinum
Hybrid Vehicles
Mydesign   1/4/2013 5:27:46 AM
Charles, there is no doubt that hybrid cars will gain more momentum in coming years. We cannot depend always on gasoline as fuel because of various crises in Arab countries. In such situations hybrid vehicles are the best solutions.

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