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Jack Rupert, PE
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Re: Like bees?
Jack Rupert, PE   9/17/2012 4:01:52 PM
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I'm not sure I see the concern about swarming with these bigger units.  (The micro robots in "Prey" are a different story).  How is that much different than having individually controlled UAV's with auto-pilot turned on?  Instead of a group of people trying to synchronize their movements to achieve a co-ordinated effort it can now be done by a single operator.  Actually, any cooridinated air attach could be considered a swarm, its just the number of people that need to be involved (and therefore the number of chances for operator error).

Ann R. Thryft
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Re: Like bees?
Ann R. Thryft   9/17/2012 3:29:13 PM
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OK, now I get you TJ. I wasn't thinking of a possible hostile use of swarming bots, but that's a really good point. Let's hope no one writes popular fiction about it.

TJ McDermott
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Re: Like bees?
TJ McDermott   9/17/2012 12:26:11 PM
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Ann, I'm not worried so much about them going out of control.  I'm much more concerned about them being used in an aggressive manner.

One does not even have to board an aircraft anymore to use it for offense, if a swarm of UAVs can do the job.

While it smacks of science fiction, so did Tom Clancy's "Debt of Honor".  Seven years after its publication, we saw fiction can become horrific reality.

I'm not automatically against this technology, but I think it can be TOO easily misused.  One can say that of any technology, but this one is very easily subverted.

Japan, during WWII, launched an incendiary attack on the continental USA using balloons that drifted across the Pacific.  It was completely ineffective.

Last decade, a man used a bunch of balloons to soar in just a lawn chair.  This is the proper use of simple lighter-than-air technology.

I see the same thing happening with swarms of UAVs, but hopefully we'll see a crazy man in a lawn chair hoisted aloft with his UAV swarm and never see the other sort of use.

 

 

Ann R. Thryft
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Re: Like bees?
Ann R. Thryft   9/17/2012 12:13:26 PM
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TJ, sounds like you don't relish seeing lots of these in the skies. Your comment make me think of the swarming robots in Michael Crichton's novel Prey, although those were, of course, much smaller nanobots. But the question is similar: what happens if they get out of control? Do we all watch/read too much sci-fi? I'm never sure...

Ann R. Thryft
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Re: Like bees?
Ann R. Thryft   9/17/2012 12:12:41 PM
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Interesting app, Thinking_J. I'm familiar with the general problem you mention, but in much denser areas than 2 people per sq mi. Search and rescue is one of the apps I've seen mentioned for autonomous swarming UAVs and flying robots. I don't see why it couldn't be applied to wider areas.

William K.
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Autonomous robot swarms?
William K.   9/16/2012 4:47:29 AM
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UAV swarms would certainly offer a great deal of potential for search and rescue operations, that does seem like a very good application indeed. But then the next stage of evolution, in warfare, would be just like the airplane: first, for observation, and next as an additional weapon. A swarm of armed drones would be quite an effective way to support ground troops, but it would have the terrible risk of being tricked by the enemy. GPS "spoofing", and other methoids of misleading, have all ready been found and demonstrated to work. So there are quite a few potential serious hazards associated with such a swarm technology, since the swarm must communicate to function. The inter-element communications links are the weakest points in swarm technology, and should not be ignored. That is the place where defense against a swarm could be made.

Thinking_J
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Re: Like bees?
Thinking_J   9/14/2012 8:47:09 PM
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TJ McDermott...

You are correct.. These risks apply to nearly all technology.

Ann... Thanks for update. Interesting to see "swarming" applied to a bit larger platforms.

I could see these being used for wide area search and rescue!  A problem out here in the "west" ... elderly wandering off in the desert. Too big of area for most Civil Aviation authorities to work with their resources (my county is over 8,000 sq miles with approx 26 people per sq mile avg) .. dang, it's getting crowded around here.

Ann R. Thryft
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Re: Like bees?
Ann R. Thryft   9/10/2012 12:32:32 PM
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Thanks, Chuck. I've been amazed at so many of the just plain far-out advancements in robotics, but I think that some of the swarming technology is truly mind-boggling. So are some of the biomimicry breakthroughs in robotics--just wait til you see some of my upcoming posts, like today's about rat heart muscles and jellyfish:
http://www.designnews.com/author.asp?section_id=1386&doc_id=250357



TJ McDermott
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Re: Like bees?
TJ McDermott   9/8/2012 10:38:23 PM
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Laws are only good for those that follow them.  They do absolutely nothing for those that do not care they are breaking a law.

Swarming UAVs makes me think we need a defense against them sooner rather than later.  How would one stop a swarm?  We might see history come full circle, with barrage balloons over our cities like London 1940.

Charles Murray
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Re: Like bees?
Charles Murray   9/7/2012 5:50:18 PM
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Kudos, Ann, on your ongoing coverage of a subject that is otherwise not getting much press. The technology is a testament to the incredible advances in coordinated wireless computing.

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