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Charles Murray
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Volticide
Charles Murray   9/5/2012 6:45:43 PM
NO RATINGS
RalphyBoy, I agree with you when you say that the Volt is not an "everyman car" right now. I've had the opportunity to drive the Volt on two occasions, each for a week, and it's a wonderful car, a joy to drive. But it's hard for the average American to justify spending $40K on the Volt when he/she can get a Chevy Cruze Eco for about half that price. GM knows that it needs to squeeze a lot of cost out of the Volt, but the company's engineers believe they can get there, and I believe they will stick with it until they do.

Ralphy Boy
User Rank
Platinum
Re: Volticide
Ralphy Boy   9/5/2012 5:50:08 PM
NO RATINGS
I say the Volt is over priced... because @ $40k it is not an everyman's car...  1.5 million Vettes were sold over the years, but from early on it was never an everyman's car. It was a Vette' for God's sake. It's sales in the beginning were also very low, but WOW what a car. I compared these two because there seemed to be some stretching by others to make a comparison... I would never do that on my own.

I was actually hoping to be able to look at the Volt in 08' when I bought my Accord. Perhaps I would have waited the year or 2 with that purchase (I actually wanted to) but the Volt's projected price and delays made that something that I decided against. The Accord is an awesome car btw @ only $18k (what I paid) and 28mpg without a sneeze for 120k miles. 

The place I work at had a policy in 08' that allowed employee EVs to be plugged in for free. Since I drive 45 miles each way... that'd be perfect for the Volt. I'm not sure if the policy has changed. No one has taken them up on it at our plant but we have an older company owned Prius sitting in the lot, (needs a battery).

My old partner at work was drooling over the GM/Chevy line in 2010. He is an ex-union car body company tool maker... and Obama voter. I quote... "um um um um ummmm... GM finally got it right." For days in our cubicle...  then he pulled out his money and bought a Hyundia Sonata at $20k...

Like it or not this is the competition for the Volt with many of us every-day-people. That and the Hybrid Sonata and the like @ $25k... Even giving extra credit for extra effort on the drive train... $30k is pushing it. Minus those like myself who resent the $25B still out standing on the bailout, and some other missteps from a publicity pov... and good luck.

I don't dislike the workers at GM, but I do resent the loss of $25B to prop up a company that makes average cars. That $25B was a huge negative in many minds and it is up to GM to over come that. Reworded; $25B in negative publicity. And WE didn't do that to GM... 

Lastly... get that Volt lease that  Architect   pointed to @ 9/4/2012 1:25:34 PM to come to my area and I absolutely will consider doing a lease in another 2 years when I replace my Accord. Heck I might even look at that lease deal right after Christmas... (market at that price point... and if the Volt meets the hype watch them sell).

tekochip
User Rank
Platinum
Re: The Volt is Unique
tekochip   9/5/2012 10:25:07 AM
NO RATINGS
Thanks Daniel, it's great to hear from somebody that owns the product.

DanielJoseph
User Rank
Gold
Re: Volticide
DanielJoseph   9/5/2012 10:03:45 AM
So have you driven a Volt? 

...and I'm missing the over priced part... it's brand stinking new technology so it DOES costs a lot to build.  There's more software in that car than a new Boeing Dreamliner 787 by over one million lines of code.  We're not talking about a TV here. 

I don't like the Gov't trying to pick winners and losers, but the prius got the subsidy until their sales volume exhausted it,  why shouldn't the domestic Volt, or Ford's offering?, I appreciate the offerings we have to date.  Time will only bring more choices and lower costs. 

Blindly believe... come on man, I have two of them.  There is no believe, I am kicking butt on the money I am not spending on fuel.  At the end of the year my wife went on a trip to NYC to see three broadway shows with our two daughters with the money she saved in fuel costs.  We are better off because of these cars and so is anyone who can acquire one.  And we eliminate any worry about how fuel costs affect our budget.  It has ZERO effect now.  I spend more on snacks during a week than I do on gas for a month. 

DanielJoseph
User Rank
Gold
Re: The Volt is Unique
DanielJoseph   9/5/2012 9:44:05 AM
Good morning!  The charging setup I have is pretty basic.  I simply plugged one Volt on one side of the garage and the other one on the other side.   I am charging with 110V at home.  My wife and I are usually home by 8:00pm so the car are ready to go at 6:00am (typical max charge time at 110V is 9.5 hours).   I did add a KWH meter to one charging point so I could measure exactly how much electricity it takes.  14 KWH is what it takes.   I pay around .08/KHW, so total cost to charge at home is $1.12.  Ok, so I have two Volts charging every night, did I see any bump in my electric - well - no because I took steps to use less electricity in the house overall.  14KWH or even 28 KWH is not a lot.  I have a 3200 sq ft house and being in Texas, it get's hot.  So just a little tweaking with the house saves enough to balance it out.     At work we have a 230V charger and it charges empty to full in about 3.5 hours.

Miles driven per day - right at 100 for me, and probably close to that for my wife.  We live out in the country so nothing is close.  Right now, the best deal is to lease the car.  As I mentioned yesterday, GM is just now allowing dealers to put a couple volts into their loaner car fleet.  Once the cars hit a certian mileage threshold, they are then sold at a lower price, so... if you are worried about budget, keep your eye out for one of these.   It could be how the lower than average leases are appearing in the papers.  I am paying $320/month for 15000 miles per year on a 3 year lease.  I am saving a total of about $500.00 per month is fuel costs per Volt.  Pretty easy math.  I have never leased in my life until this car simply because battery technology is improving so quickly that I would prefer to move on to the next generation in 2014 and not have to deal with unloading the 2011.  However, if fuel prices comtinnue to climb, I doubt I would have any trouble unloading it.

I agree the price is too high, but so were plasma TVs when they first came out.  It took first adopters to move the price down over several years.  This car is far and away more sophisticated than any plasma TV, as as your life could depend on its reliability (unlikely to be the case with any TV), you will not see the same price decay curve you see with retail electronics.  

Personally, I think as Americans we waste more than we are aware of.  This car is an investment and I think if you fiddle faddle around worrying about the numbers, you will never take the oppportunity to be part of the solution of reducing America's oil dependence not to mention this: for about 98 miles each day I drive, my car's engine is generating zero heat.  Just eliminating all that heat is a cool thing to me. 

akwaman
User Rank
Gold
Where's all the disgruntled Volt owners?
akwaman   9/5/2012 9:26:02 AM
NO RATINGS
I put up a challenge for all those people with Volts to tell us what they think about their car, and...  No negativity here from the owners, only praise.  The negativity is from the people that DON'T own one.  Hmmm.  Exactly as I expected.  Even after a contributer tells in detail how much money they save and how much they love their Volt, some genius writes a comment about how they "think" that they are priced too high and nobody wants them.  A lot of opinions from people who have no evidence, EXCEPT THE PEOPLE HERE TELLING YOU HOW MUCH THEY LOVE THEM AND HOW MUCH THEY SAVE !!!!  Some poeple are so set with their ideas that they can't even see what is right in front of their face.  Mellowfellow is right about one thing, there is a problem with marketing and promotion... they don't WANT to.  You really think Chevy doensn't know how to market a car?  GMAFB

 

melllowfelllow
User Rank
Gold
Re: Volticide
melllowfelllow   9/5/2012 3:54:35 AM
NO RATINGS
Thanks to the folks that took the time to read one or two sentences from my original post and use it as a platform to say what was on their mind. In case someone actually read all of it and is still confused about used Corvettes, I will try to clarify.

I only identified 2 issues that I have with the Volt -

1. Marketing and Promotion.

2. Price.

The comments on the Volt and Corvette were about 2 limited production products that represent a drop in the GM bucket of units shipped [1-2% total??].  One of the lines [that would be the Corvette] has the 'buzz' and folks wanting it and is intended to be a limited production vehicle. The other line [that would be the Volt] was intended to be at a higher volume by now - but it is not.  The point is that GM has failed to effectively Market and Promote the Volt.

Amazing talents...

I am amazed that some folks can know what others have driven or not driven, what vehicles they own or do not own, and what they know or do not know.  These revelations often occur when the target has not engaged in the appropriate amount of 'happy talk'.

6Lz

Ralphy Boy
User Rank
Platinum
Re: Volticide
Ralphy Boy   9/5/2012 12:28:12 AM
NO RATINGS
"So I have to imagine you have not driven a Volt nor looked at how many used corvettes are available for sale (on carmax in my area, there are 15) and how many used Volts are available for sale (in my area, only 1). Hmmm, I think you have an idea in your head, but certianly not enough information to back it up.    I am in an area where both cars are plentiful."

This is not even apples and oranges... This is sand on a beach and water in a desert... Even 1 Volt on the used market in an area is a decent percentage...

"I am disappointed at how many people think they are the only thinkers.  We are all on the same team and we have to start thinking that way or we will be toast as a nation - who wants a nation full of negative nellies.  Not me!"

So... blindly believe that the over-priced government-subsidized volt is awesome or be a negative nellie? Way to make friends.

See I was being nice but it appears that there are a number of people posting on this topic that have vested interest in the Volt/GM... Biased much?

This thread officially reeks of desperation.

Ralphy Boy
User Rank
Platinum
Re: The Volt is Unique
Ralphy Boy   9/4/2012 9:50:08 PM
NO RATINGS
The first time I saw the Volt's tech I realized that it had merit. Curious, what is your plug in setup? Are you in a driveway or garage? Miles driven a day? Charging times?

EVs of all persuasions are at least in my mind mostly niche vehicles. Not everyone can use one every day. My main problem with the EV and specifically the Volt is the hype and the subsidies.

Tax breaks are not the same as out and out payoffs to the manufacturer and buyers. Solar has been being subsidized for decades now... I still see news stories of Gov grants for solar that don't add up.

Too much money being thrown around will usually attract corruption, and the corrupt will fight to keep the cash flowing even for unproductive ideas.

So when I saw the Volt and thought it would be good, I was thinking $25k to $30k. And something easy/safe to charge. That plus some universality of the chassie/drive train so that a number of models could be offered.

This one as interesting as it is, even after Gov Aid is a bit over priced for what it is to many of us.

Ralphy Boy
User Rank
Platinum
Re: The Volt is Unique
Ralphy Boy   9/4/2012 9:45:09 PM
NO RATINGS
The first time I saw the Volt's tech I realized that it had merit. Curious, what is your plug in setup? Are you in a driveway or garage? Miles driven a day? Charging times?

EVs of all persuasions are at least in my mind mostly niche vehicles. Not everyone can use one every day. My main problem with the EV and specifically the Volt is the hype and the subsidies.

Tax breaks are not the same as out and out payoffs to the manufacturer and buyers. Solar has been being subsidized for decades now... I still see news stories of Gov grants for solar that don't add up.

Too much money being thrown around will usually attract corruption, and the corrupt will fight to keep the cash flowing even for unproductive ideas.

So when I saw the Volt and thought is would be good, I was thinking $25k to $30k. And something easy/safe to charge. That plus some universality of the chassie/drive train so that a number of models could be offered.

This one as interesting as it is, even after Gov Aid is a bit over priced for what it is to many of us.

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