HOME  |  NEWS  |  BLOGS  |  MESSAGES  |  FEATURES  |  VIDEOS  |  WEBINARS  |  INDUSTRIES  |  FOCUS ON FUNDAMENTALS
  |  REGISTER  |  LOGIN  |  HELP
<<  <  Page 5/6  >  >>
sensor pro
User Rank
Gold
Re: What's so hard about battery technology?
sensor pro   12/14/2011 10:06:42 AM
NO RATINGS
I think it is very positive move on his part to invest into something as practical as this. Clearly we need serious investment to try and find a solution to portable power.

davidwheath
User Rank
Iron
Re: What's so hard about battery technology?
davidwheath   12/14/2011 10:05:15 AM
NO RATINGS
Do you complain when you have to refuel your car before reaching your destination? Maybe you find it inconvenient to eat more than once a week. Batteries have come a long way, but can't keep up with the demands and wants of the people. I've had this discussion several times.

davidwheath
User Rank
Iron
Re: What's so hard about battery technology?
davidwheath   12/14/2011 9:50:24 AM
NO RATINGS
Whole-heartedly agree. Too bad we can't change human behavior. Everyone wants more, bigger/smaller, and faster and they want it yesterday. Nevermind the fact we don't need or use it. And I include myself in that behavior as well.

Nick
User Rank
Iron
Re: What's so hard about battery technology?
Nick   12/14/2011 9:39:34 AM
NO RATINGS
I'm far from a battery expert, but my belief is that the substances known to be suitable to build a battery simply don't have the capacity to develop electrical energy for truly long periods.  Think of what is required - regardless of whether we're talking energy storage for wind, or solar, you'd better be able to provide a clean 7-days' worth of electrical energy at advertised output, and those substances simply don't exist currently.

Researchers in Germany are currently working on a battery which shows promise, but a practical prototype is still a few years away.  I don't believe that there's a, "conspiricy theory" at work, because the first one to, "reach the finish line" stands to make a big pile of jack.  Once the final barriers are broken, among other things, you'll see a subsequent, rapid de-centralization of electrical energy generation, because consumers will embrace these technologies.

I've checked into doing something for my family, and truthfully, I need to come up with at least $25,000.00 - $30,000.00 to generate a scant 12-KW reliably.  Payback is well-past 25-years, so guess what?  I'm reluctantly sticking with the electrical energy utility in our area.

 

Thanks.

vimalkumarp
User Rank
Gold
battery
vimalkumarp   12/14/2011 9:26:06 AM
NO RATINGS
Since  solar and wind are intermittent this will be a great boost to the efforts for finding soultions to the energy problem

Semipro
User Rank
Iron
Re: What's so hard about battery technology?
Semipro   12/14/2011 9:21:28 AM
NO RATINGS
"Why is it so hard to make batteries that last long enough for the application, whether it's laptops, EVs or the grid? What's the big deal?"



Are you serious?

Jerry dycus
User Rank
Gold
Re: What's so hard about battery technology?
Jerry dycus   12/13/2011 5:58:21 PM
NO RATINGS
 

  What's the big deal?  Spoken like someone who doesn't have to do it.

  Facts are we have improved batteries by a factor of 4 but no matter how good they are, everyone wants more for less in a smaller size. Then they bitch when given bleeding edge tech and the laptop bursts into flames! 

  Maybe consumers could stop wanting all those features they never use, maybe a slower cpu or a car that does take 4000lbs to move a 200lb person around?

  And back on topic, we already have $100/kwhr batteries for grid UPS work. They are called lead batteries.  Yet no grid battery banks of them. Why?   Lead in grid UPS use costs under $10/kwhr/yr.

   Could it be there is no market for batteries in that service? 

Jerry dycus
User Rank
Gold
Re: What's so hard about battery technology?
Jerry dycus   12/13/2011 5:45:49 PM
NO RATINGS
 

  Hi Ann and All,

        Grid storage other than very short term like under 5 minutes peaking  isn't a problem at all.  Why is the grid has been doing that, adjusting the grid since it began around 1900.

       Facts are grid demand is far more variable than RE and supply and demand are really just 2 sides of the same coin. So No, you don't need more than 2% of grid storage and that is just for smoothing out the second to second difference between supply and demand.

       Though that will easily be solved by the smart grid along with home, apt and EV batteries, charging when cheap to absorb extra grid power at night and between daytime peaks while supplying power during peaks.   The utility saves so much in peak power costs and added revenue at off peak EV's might get free fuel for their service.

      Recent CCGT tech can be throttled up to 50% power using NG also will cut the need for grid storage.

  Another Solar thermal panels are used to suppliment NG power plants meaning no storage needed.  Biomass, Hydro also are on demand.   Really the only problems are big distant wind farms that start/stop together and even their with cogen biomass to cover when the wind isn't blowing.

   And last for now, far more RE spread out in small systems on many homes, buildings will average out very well again making storage far less.

  This whole scam was made up by big energy/power because they know RE is already if well shopped in many places competitive with coal even before the 30k people/yr in the US that die, etc. from it's pollution.  And they want the corporate welfare to continue paying congress to make sure it happens.

 

Ann R. Thryft
User Rank
Blogger
What's so hard about battery technology?
Ann R. Thryft   12/13/2011 3:36:01 PM
NO RATINGS

Yet another battery that can't hold a charge longer than four hours--reminds me of the ones on my laptop that barely lasted that long last week during a power outage. 

So I'm asking again (I asked this regarding another story), why is it so hard to make batteries that last long enough for the application, whether it's laptops, EVs or the grid? What's the big deal?

And another couple of questions: what are the maintenance costs and what are the hazards of a spent battery, given the metal salts being used?


Charles Murray
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Energy storage for 'Big' applications absolutely necessary
Charles Murray   12/13/2011 1:19:06 PM
NO RATINGS
Good point, DW. I can't imagine any reason why there wouldn't be.

<<  <  Page 5/6  >  >>


Partner Zone
Latest Analysis
Tesla Motors Inc. took another big step into the battery market last night, officially unveiling a strategy that would enable it to sell batteries into home and grid storage applications.
At some point in the distant future, we may all be driving electric cars. Until then, however, the debate over their ongoing viability rages on.
Machine vision and video streaming systems are used for a variety of purposes, and each has applications for which it is best suited. This denotes that there are differences between them, and these differences can be categorized as the type of lenses used, the resolution of imaging elements, and the underlying software used to interpret the data.
Comic books long have appealed to kids as a fun way to introduce reading and art without being overly didactic. Now a software engineer and project manager from Oklahoma thinks the medium can be used to get them interested in STEM careers.
Sherlock Ohms highlights stories told by engineers who have used their deductive reasoning and technical prowess to troubleshoot and solve the most perplexing engineering mysteries.
More:Blogs|News
Design News Webinar Series
3/31/2015 11:00 a.m. California / 2:00 p.m. New York
2/25/2015 11:00 a.m. California / 2:00 p.m. New York
12/11/2014 8:00 a.m. California / 11:00 a.m. New York
5/7/2015 11:00 a.m. California / 2:00 p.m. New York
Quick Poll
The Continuing Education Center offers engineers an entirely new way to get the education they need to formulate next-generation solutions.
May 4 - 8, Designing Low Power Systems using Battery and Energy Harvesting Energy Sources
SEMESTERS: 1  |  2  |  3  |  4  |  5  |  6 |  7


Focus on Fundamentals consists of 45-minute on-line classes that cover a host of technologies. You learn without leaving the comfort of your desk. All classes are taught by subject-matter experts and all are archived. So if you can't attend live, attend at your convenience.
Last Archived Class
Sponsored by Proto Labs
Learn More   |   Login   |   Archived Classes
Twitter Feed
Design News Twitter Feed
Like Us on Facebook

Sponsored Content

Technology Marketplace

Copyright © 2015 UBM Canon, A UBM company, All rights reserved. Privacy Policy | Terms of Service