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Captain Hybrid

Slideshow: Why Automakers Are Rolling Out Electric Cars

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Charles Murray
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Blogger
Re: Purely EV are not as Eco Friendly as you might believe...
Charles Murray   12/6/2012 4:30:07 PM
Professor Michalek and the other contributors, who wrote the paper that was published by the National Academies, were very clear in saying that the Leaf has no emissions from the tailpipe. Their point is that when you weigh the emissions from the battery manufacturing process, and add those to the utility powerplant emissions, the pure electric vehicles don't do as well as hybrids.  

Charles Murray
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Blogger
Re: Last to the Party
Charles Murray   12/6/2012 4:34:31 PM
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Good point, tekochip. It's often said that it's best to be second. Let the trailblazer make the mistakes. But it's important to be right behind that trailblazer, otherwise you might be left behind.

Architect
User Rank
Gold
Re: Last to the Party
Architect   12/6/2012 4:50:34 PM
 

Bob Lutz told me before I talked with Mark that the Converj/ ELR should have been on the road by now.

The ELR is perfect for the well heeled who have a high responsibility quotent.

Perhaps the most beautiful American Automobile in many decades. I'd rank it right up there with the one designed my my Friend Gordon Buehrig... the 20Grand.

Holding it back for too long is like shooting youself in the foot.

Yes these cars are conceptually like the WWII submarines... run by electric, built by Electric Boat with motor generator sets in the back and they essentially have unlimited range.

GM's designs are vastly superior to Elon's although he deserves some credit.

GM is not dipping it's toe in the water at all... it's almost up to the knee.

You have to credit Lutz with all this and for those who want to whine and cry about government involvement you should whine and cry about Ed Whitacre who may have known how to build incandescent light bulbs but had absolutely no idea what the hell a Car company is and what makes it go.

Rattner did not know what he was doing in putting ED in charge because important product has been delayed as a result of Ed's cavalier and ignorant attitude. How frequently do you change lightbulb designs? Have they changed yet?

That is something worthy of upset!

And today it was announced that GM has sold more cars in China than the US this past month.

Bill Dickens

 

Rigby5
User Rank
Gold
Re: Business Model doesn't Fail with battery exchanges
Rigby5   12/6/2012 10:15:17 PM
If the government would have used the bail outs to force car makers to devise a common battery standard, then electric and hybrid cars would be much more attractive.

If all of them used the exact same form factor battery back, then you could establish battery exchanges.  You could buy a membership, and it would be not only an insurance policy to cover battery failure risk, but allow for greatly extenede range, simply by replacing the battery pack instead of waiting for it to recharge.

Then many more people would feel there was not longer any risk involved in buying an electric or hybrid vehicle.

CharlesM
User Rank
Silver
Why this article?
CharlesM   12/7/2012 11:56:37 AM
Maybe it's about growth and the future of the automobile:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/toddwoody/2012/12/06/electric-car-sales-hit-another-record/ 

Should we expect a more radically abrupt shift? How many early car companies survived the sharpest growth decades for automobiles? How many dot com businesses survived the '90s boom and did that result in the internet going out of business? I'm not saying EV makers will go bankrupt, but the quick high profit strategy of selling as many high margin gas guzzlers while they are hot, with no eye toward the future, hasn't worked out too well either.

Keep trying to scare off early adapters, Mr. Murray.  But your anti-EV bias is showing.

Which reminds me it's about time again for another Global Warming is an Al Gore Hoax article from UBM.

tluxon
User Rank
Gold
Re: Why this article?
tluxon   12/7/2012 12:22:44 PM
I guess it depends on whose twisted version of reality we want to adhere to.  The oil cartels have stood in the way of developing other energy paradigms while limiting their product for maximum profit.  Al Gore tried to convince and manipulate the masses that consensus could be reached in premature scratching-the-surface "science" for the financial and political gain of his side of the energy market.  Neither side has represented themselves in an ethically honest manner, and have been unable to hide that their true motivation is for money and control rather than for the empowerment and good of the rest of us.

CharlesM
User Rank
Silver
Re: Why this article?
CharlesM   12/7/2012 12:29:57 PM
Do you have any evidence of your charges against Gore? Even if true, Gore is out-bankrolled by the propaganda efforts of the fossil fuel industry by several orders of magnitude.

In any event Gore is irrelevant to any question over climate change. Try again.

tluxon
User Rank
Gold
Re: Why this article?
tluxon   12/7/2012 3:05:44 PM
Try again?  You brought up Al Gore - I simply responded.

As for addressing climate change, we need to be wiser than to keep falling for the problem-reaction-solution gimmicks played on us to keep funneling money from the masses to the "elite".  Funny that their "solutions" always seem to place more limitations on us than on them.

Nonetheless, I'm curious to know why the very concerning issue of oxygen depletion isn't getting the same attention that's being given to rising CO2 levels.  It would not surprise me to discover how much it has to do with how the "solutions" meet the moneychangers' true objectives.

vfx
User Rank
Iron
Re: Purely EV are not as Eco Friendly as you might believe...
vfx   12/7/2012 4:50:56 PM
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That "study" is prety vauge with phrases like, "In contrast, if plug-in vehicles are charged using coal-generated electricity, they could cause several thousands of dollars more damage per vehicle."

Really? "could cause"?? That's opinion, not a study and only a shrinking handfull of states are running on 100% coal. All  other states have EVs as cleaner.  It does go on to say, " There are myriad other arguments for supporting vehicle electrification beyond human health, environmental, and oil-displacement effects. This long list might include job creation, reducing the trade deficit by shifting from foreign to domestic fuel sources, enabling a distributed storage resource to support the integration of intermittent renewable electricity generation, reducing oil revenues to states hostile to U.S. interests, hedging against an anticipated oil-scarce or carbon-constrained future, improving regulatory control over emissions associated with poor vehicle maintenance, generating positive externalities by encouraging innovation, encouraging domestic development of strategic technical competency and intellectual property, reducing nonfinancial political and human suffering effects from war and political instability, and promoting international environmental justice. However, because HEVs and PHEVs with smaller battery packs provide more air-emissions reduction and oil displacement per dollar spent and offer lifetime costs competitive with conventional vehicles, it is not clear that directing near-term subsidies toward vehicles with large battery packs would produce superior results on any of these objectives.

So if you are referencing it as an attack on "green" transpotation, it sure makes up for it by pointing out all the other reasons for getting off oil.

vfx
User Rank
Iron
Re: Wrong market
vfx   12/7/2012 4:54:53 PM
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Seems like every Post Office in the US does a long test on electric delivery trucks, deterimies it would save them millions and then orders the same thing they always did. The fix is still in.

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