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Captain Hybrid

Renovo Hypes Electric Supercar

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Mydesign
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Re: Supercar
Mydesign   9/12/2014 3:56:01 AM
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William, thanks for the clarification. Lots of mechanical datas and not so easy to digest.

William K.
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Re: Supercar
William K.   9/10/2014 3:03:20 PM
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My point is based on the fact that a dragster, at least on a dragstrip, only needs to be able to drive the quarter mile from the start line to the finish line. So if the electric dragster used up most of the battey charge in that quarter mile it would be delivering a lot more power to the wheels. Quite probably something would break, unless stronger parts were put in the drive train. But the fundamental concept is to use up the fuel, or stored energy, entirely in that one sprint. Much different from a circle-track car.

Consider that those highest powered fuel dragsters go through several gallons of fuel for that quarter mile run. That is the fuel analogy of using all the charge, sort of.

Mydesign
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Re: Supercar
Mydesign   9/10/2014 3:43:09 AM
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"zero to 60 in 3.4 seconds is good, but probably the controls could be adjusted to make it a good dragster, with a range of a bit more than a quarter mile. My point being that similar to what Chgarles points out, this is a status toy and neither effectiveness nor economy even enter into the discussion."

William, am not getting your point. Can you be please elaberative.

Amclaussen
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Re: Let's not forget "pure" electrics are not that good...
Amclaussen   9/8/2014 2:41:02 PM
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Thanks Charles; it is one of the few studies that we reviewed, but, as I've said, we identified a few inconsistencies and decided to proceed and perform our own study!  Even when there were some approximate considerations in that study, the main conclusion (that the purely electrical vehicle was NOT as "green" when compared to the most popular hybrid), remains true, no doubt about that.

One of the main inefficiencies of the purely electric vehicle, that people forget to include in their quick analyses, is related to the battery being intrinsically inefficient... not all and everyone of the ampere-hour put into the battery by the charger is recovered entirely when running the vehicle, heat is generated and wasted everytime the batery is recharged (and discharged too), and that is a fact of life. another fact frequently ignored is the true ecological costs -and damages- that their manufacture implies, apart from the use of materials that is not as green as many want to believe.

Thanks for the interesting article.  I'm not either against or in favor of electrics, for me it is an exercise on engineering, but when I see politicians and people making outrageous claims towards a completely "green solution", I often find flawed and rushed conclusions.  The move of the Mexico City government of precipitating to purchase (and obligue the use of) electric taxis, that we the citizens will have to pay for, is what really gets us mad at them. Amclaussen.

Trenth
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Re: Different points of view?
Trenth   9/7/2014 10:37:11 PM
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All wheel drive is much safer, and holds the road better in all conditions.   I ski, and go to the beach, I drive in terrible rain and snow, and ocasioanl gravel and sandy roads. 

William K.
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Re: Supercar
William K.   9/6/2014 5:18:19 PM
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zero to 60 in 3.4 seconds is good, but probably the controls could be adjusted to make it a good dragster, with a range of a bit more than a quarter mile.

My point being that similar to what Chgarles points out, this is a status toy and neither effectiveness nor economy even enter into the discussion.

William K.
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Re: Different points of view?
William K.   9/6/2014 5:14:06 PM
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Really? All wheel drive is handy for off-road driving, front wheel drive is best for not getting stuck on slippery streets, but rear wheel drive is what can provide the best handling, if the suspension is not so de-tuned as to make the car understeer for my grandmother to drive. The main motivation for front wheel drive has always been weight reduction and cost reduction, no matter what other benefits are claimed to be provided.

Charles Murray
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Re: Let's not forget "pure" electrics are not that good...
Charles Murray   9/5/2014 5:13:27 PM
Here's a 2012 study that's slightly different than yours, amclausen, but with similar conclusions.

http://www.designnews.com/author.asp?doc_id=254150

Amclaussen
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Platinum
Let's not forget "pure" electrics are not that good...
Amclaussen   9/5/2014 1:02:42 PM
Interesting comments from engineers, as usually at this excellent site, BUT...

A thing that needs to be remembered by everybody, is that "pure" electrics (at least for the moment), are not really all that "green". When the entire life-cycle of a car is considered, the pure electrics have already produced a lot of contaminants even before being sold to the driver, and they continue to produce them after being discarded too.  There are studies that have evaluated in detail the pollutant contribution of purely electrical vehicles like the mentioned Nissan Leaf.

At first sight (and believing the over-hyped vendor claims), it appears to be an ecological marvel, but careful comparison with even older hybrid vehicles (the Prius, to be precise), show that the Leaf is actually more damaging to the environment. Here at my workplace, we critically reviewed those studies, found some inconsistencies, and then decided to run our very own tests and calculations: even when some of the conclusions and considerations of those studies were debatable, in the end we arrived at roughly the same results.  Alas, in the process we found some other unexpected information.  Real-life data from the Electric Taxi fleet bought by the local government without any serious study, and possibly with the "uninterested" help from Nissan (that incidentally, sold a pair of the Leafs to the former city major and his ecology and environment secretary -at a highly $ymbolic price, of course-), threw a lot of light into the real operational costs and limitations of the vehicle. At first, the taxi drivers were extremely proud and happy, then, after some time, the severe duty that the taxis had to endure started producing real-life failures and specially, the failure to meet the expectations.  Initially, the car maker was happily repairing most of the problems, but as more and more repairs were costing them quite more that the cost of the "free" initial publicity, they were secretly desiring they would had never got involved!  and now everyone is forced to display a false smile and have to contain themseves (they are furious to put it mildly): the government of the city, the drivers, and the car maker too!  We don't know for shure how a Prius Taxi Fleet would compare because there is not a single Prius being used as a Taxi in Mexico City, but one thing we are quite shure is that not everything is nice and sweet with the Leaf.  Problems pertain to many drivetrain components, not only the very expensive batteries, but including controls, motors and too many other parts to mention. But we do have plenty of hard data on Internal Combustion Nissan Tsurus, Sentras and othe similar  taxis. In real life, the Leaf fleet simply does not meet the specifications regarding mileage, recharging performance and true cost to own and operate the vehicle, and this will only become worse when, soon, the majority of the fleet will require a full battery replacement (and someone will have to pay the disposal and recycling, naively forgotten by the government self appointed experts)...

Trenth
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Gold
Re: Different points of view?
Trenth   9/3/2014 8:24:05 PM
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I know, but looks like I might have to reconsider.  

Subaru has a hybrid.  

 

No URLs means no facts.  

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